Fairey 14

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rme_01
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Joined: Thu Sep 02, 2010 4:57 pm

Fairey 14

Post by rme_01 »

As something of a newcomer to the forum I would really appreciate help with sorting out my Fairey 14 K680. When I bought her the hull was in good shape but because in the past she had been used as a yacht tender many of the original components (rig, rudder, mainsheet fittings etc.) and associated set-up details have been lost. Whilst I appreciate that as a development class she may anyhow have been modified during her racing career I am trying (up to a point!!) to put her back to near original (1957) shape. I have put some relevant photos on

https://picasaweb.google.com/rmeastham/ ... 4Ss8qvuLQ#

1. the mainsheet arrangement – judging from the T Vaughan book it would seem that up to around 1956 the normal Fairey arrangement was a stern mainsheet attached to a tubular horse running over the cut out at the top of the transom. K680 however has the small tiller aperture cut into the transom itself (see photo) and I would guess from the filled holes that this originally had a track across it (with probably just stops rather than control lines). Is that correct and would the sheeting originally have stayed at the stern or been led forward to a centre block? The current centre block/jamming cleat is clearly not original but there is a tufnol-covered hole just forward of it. That said centre sheeting would seem to be at odds with the winch on the thwart, which I understand to be part of a roller reefing system.

2. control line fittings - there are bronze turning blocks either side of the centreboard case which are clearly original and also small stainless ones on top of the case which may not be (see photos). As helmsman led control lines were fairly limited in those days I am tempted to think these might have been for the spinnaker halyard/downhaul. If not what?

3. kicking strap – this is missing so I need to make one up - what was the standard configuration then?

4. centreboard – as a wooden board I would assume that there was no lifting gear, just rubber door stop type “handles” or similar to manually raise and lower it. Curiously however there is a slightly raised domed section built onto the starboard side of the board where the handles would go but nothing on the port side. Is there any significance in this?

5. tanks – the sealed aft sections of the side tanks have no inspection hatches or drainage plugs to let them air albeit judging by the facing ply I think they may have been replaced at some time. I had assumed this was an oversight but looking at pictures of other Faireys I can’t see much evidence of hatches/plugs in them. Surely….?

6. rig – the mast that came with the boat is an old needlespar which I now understand came from a 470. By contrast the sails are the original Lucas sails and cut (according to Dick Bat) for a straight (non bending) spar that would have been typical of that time. I understand that the Fairey boats originally had a stiff birdcage rigged aluminium pole with a wooden top section but I am not sure whether this was still the case in 1957 (or whether all alloy had come in) and in any case doubt very much that I would find one (or even want one!). I have discussed the idea of a new wooden spar with Jeremy Freeland at Collars and whilst this is quite feasible based on the old drawings he holds, the alternative (compromise?) of a reasonably stiff alloy spar has some appeal. Would an old fifteen rig be the thing to look for or any other suggestions?

I appreciate that many of these queries would be best answered at a classic 14 event in the summer but in the meantime any help now would be appreciated!

Thanks

Robert
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Brookesy
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Re: Fairey 14

Post by Brookesy »

Very pretty boat Robert,
Alan Williams may be able to help with an old alloy Dolphin mast which has the same rough dimensions of an FD which I am sure could be made to fit the fourteen as I know it has been done before, and would I am certain it will be stiff enough. Last time I saw it the mast was alongside Alan's Finn in the grass at Roadford.
I'm sure he will be along shortly.
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Rupert
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Re: Fairey 14

Post by Rupert »

The Fairey 14's I've worked on may have been earlier examples, so things may have changed by 680, but to me, the tanks running to the stern are un fairey-like (not sure why they liked to end them 2/3 the way back, as it made the boat sink when capsized) but I have worked on ones where they had been extended. Your ones look to be in one piece, so are either as was, or alterered "properly". The thwart and centreboard case capping look like replacements, too - I'd have expected a wider thwart and narrower capping. As for the bungs and hatches, Fairey's generally put a tiny hole in the back end of their side tanks. With full length tanks, I really can't be sure what to expect.

Transom. Agree it doesn't look classic Fairey's, but it does look similar to some early open sterned Albacore transoms, so may possibly be original.

Masts...the wooden masts had diamonds and jumper stays, and early Ali masts tended to have the same arrangement. I'm sure there is someone out there with pictures of these masts. Early Flying 15's appear to have a simpler mast with no jumpers, but I can't see why this wouldn't work for the 14.

Looks like a lovely boat, & I'm sure others will have more and better at add.
Rupert
rme_01
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Joined: Thu Sep 02, 2010 4:57 pm

Re: Fairey 14

Post by rme_01 »

Thanks for yours.

I am inclined to think that the long tanks on K680 although rebuilt are on the original pattern. My (rather tenuous) reasoning is
a) that she was built after the 1955 rule change allowing increased buoyancy
b) the positioning of the knee on the main thwart is forward from the earlier versions where the knee is on the aft end of the short tank (there is a picture in the Vaughan history of a 1956 boat Shock with a similar knee positioning albeit unfortunately the tanks are covered up)
I stress this is all guessing but they don't appear to have been the result of major surgery and look about right. As to the ventilation I am glad to hear a plug was normal and will correct this!

I agree with you that the capping looks over sized albeit it does allow for the small S/S turning blocks (which probably aren't original anyhow). Interestingly Barilea (the blue one at the dinghy show a few years ago) also had a picnic table of a capping although this doesn't appear to be the case in her earlier POW photos. My guess (again!) is this idea may have been adopted when helm led control lines became more popular - certainly mine is so pockmarked with ex fitting holes that I am intending to replace it.

I am not fond of the transom but again it does appear to be original (or a hell of good rebuild!). If so it was a 57 variant as the 56 boat Shock (above) has the old style arrangement. Your theory about adopting the albacore design sounds possible given the Fairey make do (?evolutionary) approach at the time - presumably this was track/slide and stern sheeting

Finally on the mast the 2 designs I looked at with Jeremy Freeland were the Barilea one (a fairly complex 3 diamond job with very thin section) and an unattributed 2 diamond job (a thicker section with jumper struts at the upper and straight tube spreaders at the lower with the stays going directly to the existing fittings aft of the mast support). The latter is appealing albeit ? the weight and it may need to wait on a lottery win. In the meantime I doubt if a birdcage rigged alloy one will turn up so will put in a wanted for the simpler option you suggest.

Thanks for your help . This forensic business is the stuff of restoration!
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Ed
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Re: Fairey 14

Post by Ed »

Hi Robert,

I am working up towards a proper answer.....but just a bit busy this week. I certainly agree with all that Rupert has said.

It can be very hard to work out what was original and what isn't. They are after all wooden boats in a development class so, it was quite natural to pull bits out and re-build and if this was done by a professional, then it can be very hard to see when and how it was done.

I have uploaded some images of K740, which is a late and modified Fairey 14. Possibly the last built, certainly the last built for Charles Currey. Also a shot of Maelstom, prior to re-build.

Do you have the Int14 history as that has a couple of good shots of early Fairey 14s? If not, I will scan and upload.

K704 & Maelstrom:
https://picasaweb.google.com/ed.bremner ... directlink

K556 - Iolanthe:
https://picasaweb.google.com/ed.bremner ... directlink

(which I notice, I have already shared with you :-) )

K556 - Iolanthe after recent refit:
https://picasaweb.google.com/ed.bremner ... directlink

If you havn't got the Int14 history, I will put those up as well. I do have some other shots of 14s, but at moment they are being illusive, will keep looking.

cheers

eib
Ed Bremner
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rme_01
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Re: Fairey 14

Post by rme_01 »

Thanks Ed - fascinating stuff. I did manage to get a used copy of the Vaughan history a couple of months ago via Google Books and it has been a great help. Incidentally I paid 19 but notice that the cheapest now is over 90; perhaps the boats will follow! I also have some photos of the Barilea restoration which Dick Johnson kindly sent me.

The photos are very interesting. I was surprised to see the Maelstrom shot and would be interested to know where this came from. Do you know the details of this restoration - when, where, who? The stringers seem to suggest the tanks did indeed go aft albeit the position of the knees is different from the current. K740 is presumably an example of the late budget stripped out version referred to in the Vaughan history. I was also interested to see Iolanthe undergoing another refit - I thought you had sold her so this is presumably her new owners - re-plated fittings etc. looks like they are going for gold.

I am away for a couple of days but look forward to reading your "proper answer" when I am back! Thanks for your help.

Robert
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Ed
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Re: Fairey 14

Post by Ed »

I am still planning on answering.....but time is still against me.

But you asked about the photos I claimed were of Maelstrom....

and to be honest, it gave me that slight nagging feeling, that I had got it all wrong!

Two reasons:

First is that I am obviously getting old and have got everything muddled up and should of checked rather than just writing from memory!

Because of course this boat isn't Maelstrom (Fairey 14 K680 1957), which is your boat, but it is in fact Mordicus (Fairey 14 K613 1952 and POW winner)!

Sorry about that!

As for Mordicus - I have a letter from her owner, who was doing her up, and I was going to write back.....but I am not very good at letters and I fear that it found its way into that ever growing pile of 'stuff I must get around to doing'.....but never seemed to find the time for.

I thought (but now rather suspect I might be wrong) that she was the 14 that was left for many years practically abandoned in the park at Tamesis....but now just not sure.

But talking of 14s....and Tamesis....

Saw this:



cheers

eib
Ed Bremner
CVRDA


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rme_01
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Joined: Thu Sep 02, 2010 4:57 pm

Re: Fairey 14

Post by rme_01 »

thanks for yours. I was quite relieved that the photo was not Maelstrom as I didn't think she had had a complete rebuild besides which I still have this thing about the positioning of the knees over the thwart rather than at the aft end of the tank as in earlier Faireys - Shock 1956 (T Vaughan "contrast in styles" picture in first set of plates) appears to be the same. Anyhow this is idle speculation - I wait on your definitive thoughts.

Thanks for the clip - I assume everyone in the CVRDA is familiar with the wonderful NA 14s clip but attach the url in case

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ureNnXe1WZQ

I went out with a violinist a long time ago so it's a double dose of nostalgia!!
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