another varnishing related question

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neil
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Post by neil » Tue Sep 28, 2004 5:10 pm

All this talk about varnishing has got me thinking about Rannoch

Her hull is treated with Deks Olje and the decks are varnished. The hull is in pretty good condition and has I have some Le Tonkinois I thought about applying this over the Deks Olje. The bloke I bought the Le Tonkinois from said it would be fine but has anyone else done this?

The foredeck needs some work as the varnish has blistered around the the screw heads, I presume that the only course of action is to strip it all off and start again. Epifanes here I come.

The rear deck is OK but get bloody slippery when wet - not a good think in a sailing canoe. Now somewhere I read about non-slip gloss varnish but can't remember where I read it - any ideas on this one as I want a non slip but quality finish so Sex Wax etc is out of the question.

regards

Neil
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Garry R
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Post by Garry R » Wed Sep 29, 2004 9:19 am

I can vouch for the slippery nature of Blakes No 1 - a capsize last weekend had me slipping all over the place trying to get a grip of the gunwhales/rubbing strip to get her upright. The jibsheet came to the rescue as per RYA training but even the polyurethaned centreboard was tricky to get aboard. Have a lovely set of bruises on the inner thighs as a reminder!!! I have been told of crews disappearing over the side on polished decks when hiking or clinging onto the shrouds to stop themselves sliding gradually towards the stern!! So how do you get the mirror finish without the skating rink thrown in?

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Post by Rupert » Wed Sep 29, 2004 9:34 am

I've not found anything. I must admit to having always thought you can have a shiny boat or a useful boat. Sometimes parts of a useful boat can be shiny, but never a shiny boat useful! Guess it depends what you want from life! This is my excuse for our cvrda boats not winning hundreds of ribbons at roadford!
Rupert

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Ed
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Post by Ed » Wed Sep 29, 2004 11:41 am

For the Hull....I would of thought that Tonkinoil would do fine......although personally I would be tempted to just buy a can of Deks Olje topcoat and use that as Deks Olje works fine and is very well suited to an old hull like Rannoch where there is likely to be some kind of movement and ingress of water.

On the Deck......Epiphanes would be my varnish of choice..... although I am not sure that I would wish to pull all the old varnish off because of a few naff bits around the screw heads. Rannoch will have nice ply in those decks.....but you can only strip them so many times before you start to harm them. If you only have small amounts of damage I would try and fix them locally.....and live with that for a few years, untill there is more extensive damage that needs repair.

To do this...... carefully clear away any really loose old varnish and if necessary give a small sand around bad area. Then get small amount of epiphanes (or other trad varnish - not poly) and thin by a good 50% with the proper thinners. With this very thin mixture, drop a drip onto each screw head......with a little luck the varnish/thinner mix is pulled up under what loose varnish is left sticking it back down and getting rid of the nasty naff bits. Just how much you can get away with will depend on how big the loose bits of varnish are and how much you have taken off. After applying rub excess off with rag. do this a few times until no more is absorbed.....then give whole boat a decent sand down, making sure that you don't go through too much varnish, try not to touch wood anywhere. When you have done this, give a good 2/3 coats of epiphanes and she will look great. Maybe not as great as if you totally stripped her.....but....you can only do that so many times....

my other worry is that by memory the ply on Rannoch is very dark in colour.....this might well be due to the ply being stained. If so, you have to be very careful, if you start to strip the varnish, some stain will lift and some won't.....and it can be a real pig.....lots of work....and a lot of wood lost before you can get a constant colour back again.

Anyway that is just my thoughts......would certainly be interested in what other people think!

mmmmmmm.....also.....havn't you got enough work applying industrial pneumatic jacks to your poor Tideway keel to bring it back into class?

cheers

eib
Ed Bremner
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Ed
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Post by Ed » Wed Sep 29, 2004 11:44 am

Oh....forgot the non-slip.....

I think you just use a 'little' and I stress 'little' of the Blakes antislip granules in the area that you want to be non-slip. It is not like sand and is hardly noticable....as long as you don't use too much.

cheers

eib
Ed Bremner
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roger
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Post by roger » Wed Sep 29, 2004 11:59 am

Someone somewhere suggested sprinkling suger on the last coat of varnish. Thesugar dissolves and washes away leaving a non slip surface. Has anyone tried this and what are the results.
Roger
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Ed
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Post by Ed » Wed Sep 29, 2004 1:12 pm

Yup.....sugar or salt.....same thing.....

not sure really.....Personally I don't think it works as well as sand....which is not as good as the Blakes anti-slip. It is OK if the varnish is really hard so it leaves the little lumps and stuff....but if it is soft it just softens out into a bad rough finish.

Oh....I did forget one really nice way of getting a non-slip finish.....but I don't really think you could do it on Rannoch.... That is to use a 'hard' varnish by which I mean a two pack poly or epoxy and a peel-ply. This works in much the same way as when you use a peel-ply cloth to get a uniform smooth finish on your epoxy laminating.....you do all do that don't you?....if not I highly recommend it.

Anyway to get a nice non-slip use a nylon cloth with a wider weave.....plastic deck-chair cloth works well.....put one layer of varnish/paint/epoxy down as a key, let it pretty much go off and then lay another layer down but this time put the cloth on top....make sure cloth is fully saturated by varnish/paint/epoxy. Let it get to tacky stage and then peel the material back off, which will leave the surface of the material embedded into the surface of the varnish. Works a treat....although I would recommend testing first....as it can also all go horribly wrong. certainly works well for epoxy coating.....this is how the non-slip was applied to custom windsurf boards.....where they just used another bit of laminating cloth....and just remembered to pull it before it went hard!!!!!

Of course this is not really appropriate for Rannoch.....but if you wanted to coat the bottom of boat....or duckboards or something....it would work really well.

Finally....whilst my mind is on it. A FF came down to Roadford a couple of years ago and all sitting-areas of deck were non-slip and looked great. I asked how he did it, without looking too close....and was amazed when he told me....and I looked closer. He had got some sticky backed plastic sheeting, like you get for covering books and stuff on a roll and used that. It had a really nice finely grooved surface, with all the lines running in waves down the lines. He had applied it really well with no bubbles or crap caught under it. Looked really good and of course was soft enough to sit on etc.

cheers

eib
Ed Bremner
CVRDA


Jollyboat J3
Firefly F2942
IC GBR314 ex S51 - 1970 Slurp
MR 638 - Please come and take it away
Phelps Scull
Bathurst Whiff - looking for someone to love it

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