I've just 'rescued' a Harrier+ from the rapidly diminishing fleet at Whitby. I have done some surgical work on the transom which was to be expected! Having now completed the makeover with the appropriate use of gel-coat filler and International paint, I am now ready to launch. Can any of your esteemed 'members' point me in the right direction regarding mast rake, rig tension and seating position, etc.
I have had past experience of s/h sailing in Solos so would techniques employed there be apt or should I direct enquiries in the direction of the Phantoms? Thanks.
signed 15 stone 'Bobby No Mates'!
Harrier set-up
Re: Harrier set-up
Are you sailing the boat with the standard or 'plus' rig?
If you can sail the Solo then the only difference you'll find is in control of the rig - if you have the big one, you'll want to be able to depower it early on.
Sailing hints...... just keep it upright - very upright - else the interior will look like a bath house as the wet stuff comes in over the edge.
Nigel.... you're surely the man for this... agree?
D
If you can sail the Solo then the only difference you'll find is in control of the rig - if you have the big one, you'll want to be able to depower it early on.
Sailing hints...... just keep it upright - very upright - else the interior will look like a bath house as the wet stuff comes in over the edge.
Nigel.... you're surely the man for this... agree?
D
David H
Re: Harrier set-up
It's the Harrier + (plus) with the big rig. At some time in its life it has had the original single Elvstrom bailer removed. Should I endeavour to replace this via further surgery as I have one or two bailers in my spares box?
Re: Harrier set-up
I don't know much about Harriers (though there is one at Hunts) but I am about to attempt to fit bailers to my phantom, simply because I am fed up of dragging litres of water around with me every time I dip the gunwhale even slightly.
Whereabouts are you mycotty/Bobby?
Whereabouts are you mycotty/Bobby?
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OK 1954
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Laser 2
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Re: Harrier set-up
I had Harrier 57 for a while which went up to Whitby...
Definitely have the self bailer(s). Don't use an IYE type plastic imitation Elvstrom one because the location is such that you will tread on it and it will disappear through the floor. I used one of the smallest size of real Elvstrom bailer which was fine inland. Pay close attention to the kicking stap anchorage: the original was self tapping screws into the floor and inadequate! I found the original rudder blade too short and made a longer one, plus a nice and light (though I say it myself) rudder stock from foam glass and carbon. I also put in a foam sandwich transom,
Sailing, you'll want to be reasonably forward in the boat upwind. I ditched the big control supports and traveller setup and found the extra room good. I also sheeted the main off the boom, but if you're not an ex skiffy this may not appeal. Certainly keep it flat: it gets lots of wetted area if tipped. I never found filling up with water that much of an issue once I had the longer rudder blade and control could be maintained when I let it heel a bit.
Setup, nothing I can offer as I used the original rig, but added full length battens and spreaders which solved all the power problems.
Definitely have the self bailer(s). Don't use an IYE type plastic imitation Elvstrom one because the location is such that you will tread on it and it will disappear through the floor. I used one of the smallest size of real Elvstrom bailer which was fine inland. Pay close attention to the kicking stap anchorage: the original was self tapping screws into the floor and inadequate! I found the original rudder blade too short and made a longer one, plus a nice and light (though I say it myself) rudder stock from foam glass and carbon. I also put in a foam sandwich transom,
Sailing, you'll want to be reasonably forward in the boat upwind. I ditched the big control supports and traveller setup and found the extra room good. I also sheeted the main off the boom, but if you're not an ex skiffy this may not appeal. Certainly keep it flat: it gets lots of wetted area if tipped. I never found filling up with water that much of an issue once I had the longer rudder blade and control could be maintained when I let it heel a bit.
Setup, nothing I can offer as I used the original rig, but added full length battens and spreaders which solved all the power problems.
Re: Harrier set-up
Can I add one rider to Jim C's excellent comments.
Beef up the transom BEFORE putting the longer rudder blade on - else you and it may well part company. Being sat in the water, holding nothing but a tiller extension (albeit one still attached to the rudder..to the transom but nothing else) is what the computer geeks would describe as a 'Fatal Error has occured'
D
Beef up the transom BEFORE putting the longer rudder blade on - else you and it may well part company. Being sat in the water, holding nothing but a tiller extension (albeit one still attached to the rudder..to the transom but nothing else) is what the computer geeks would describe as a 'Fatal Error has occured'
D
David H
Re: Harrier set-up
In the circumstances the old "Unrecoverable Application Error" might be the more appropriate wording:-))davidh wrote:...what the computer geeks would describe as a 'Fatal Error has occured'
Re: Harrier set-up
Otherwise known as...........
The boat was okay until ***** crewed for me.
Please do not ask me who ****** could be, wild horses would not drag Rogers name from me!
D
The boat was okay until ***** crewed for me.
Please do not ask me who ****** could be, wild horses would not drag Rogers name from me!
D
David H
Re: Harrier set-up
Hi McY,
totally agree with the flat, flat, flat.......
Re Bailers, mine also had transom flaps which seemed to help but a big bucket is very useful to start the process off. It carries a huge amount of water so sailing it out takes for ever. I did consider putting buoyancy bag under the lower thwarts simply to take up some of the volume.
Re Rig settings, rake etc. I turned mine into a + with a £20 ebay ally Phantom rig (sail No.18 if I remember correctly) so it may not be directly comparable as I think the Whitby guys went for modern carbon Phantom rigs but I found in setting it up that it needed more rake than I expected. It was easy to tell though as it suffered from severe weather helm until I had raked it enough. With tuning, probably the best place to start is the Phantom association website.
Good luck with it.
Nigel
totally agree with the flat, flat, flat.......
Re Bailers, mine also had transom flaps which seemed to help but a big bucket is very useful to start the process off. It carries a huge amount of water so sailing it out takes for ever. I did consider putting buoyancy bag under the lower thwarts simply to take up some of the volume.
Re Rig settings, rake etc. I turned mine into a + with a £20 ebay ally Phantom rig (sail No.18 if I remember correctly) so it may not be directly comparable as I think the Whitby guys went for modern carbon Phantom rigs but I found in setting it up that it needed more rake than I expected. It was easy to tell though as it suffered from severe weather helm until I had raked it enough. With tuning, probably the best place to start is the Phantom association website.
Good luck with it.
Nigel
Re: Harrier set-up
Hi Nessa, JimC, et al,
I am planning to sail the Harrier+ at my Club, Loch Venachar deep in the heart of the Trossachs in central Scotland. My purchase of the boat came about really from a frustration at being unable to find a suitable crew for my lovely wooden Albacore (6936). I had remembered reading about the launch of the Harrier dinghy in the early 70s, saw one on a visit to the London Dinghy Ex, and kept it 'in mind' as a possible s/hander for my dotage! When a casual chat at an Open Meeting came round to the subject, I was made aware that the once burgeoning fleet at Whitby was now in decline for a variety of reasons. They had apparently amassed about 10 'original' Harriers and, being frustrated by their (lack of) performance in the relative confines of Whitby harbour they, through the auspicies of one of their number, a chandler and rigger, kitted the boats out with an enlarged sail (ex Phantom) and an appropriate mast. I am led to believe that a couple of years of excellent frostbiting races were enjoyed by 'wintering' big boat sailors but now the Harbour trust or some august body had 'poured cold(er!) water' on their off-season sojourns and the boats were being sold off to pastures new. Apparently my quest to purchase came just too late to snap up the best of them but I am more than happy with the craft I have adopted at a very modest price. No paperwork was available and the Whitby boys had there own numbering and naming system. My particular craft has sail number 03 on a Bruce Banks sail with a similarly stickered hull number. Also, now removed, the name 'Fleeced By No Mates' displayed in quality vinyl graphics on either side of the hull! Apparently all the Whitby boys agreed to employ 'No Mates' as part of their Harrier Plus naming system!! In deference to its Whitby origins, I have renamed her 'Scampi'.
I know of no other Harriers up here in Scotland but perhaps, after these postings and pleas, some may come out the woodwork.
I am planning to sail the Harrier+ at my Club, Loch Venachar deep in the heart of the Trossachs in central Scotland. My purchase of the boat came about really from a frustration at being unable to find a suitable crew for my lovely wooden Albacore (6936). I had remembered reading about the launch of the Harrier dinghy in the early 70s, saw one on a visit to the London Dinghy Ex, and kept it 'in mind' as a possible s/hander for my dotage! When a casual chat at an Open Meeting came round to the subject, I was made aware that the once burgeoning fleet at Whitby was now in decline for a variety of reasons. They had apparently amassed about 10 'original' Harriers and, being frustrated by their (lack of) performance in the relative confines of Whitby harbour they, through the auspicies of one of their number, a chandler and rigger, kitted the boats out with an enlarged sail (ex Phantom) and an appropriate mast. I am led to believe that a couple of years of excellent frostbiting races were enjoyed by 'wintering' big boat sailors but now the Harbour trust or some august body had 'poured cold(er!) water' on their off-season sojourns and the boats were being sold off to pastures new. Apparently my quest to purchase came just too late to snap up the best of them but I am more than happy with the craft I have adopted at a very modest price. No paperwork was available and the Whitby boys had there own numbering and naming system. My particular craft has sail number 03 on a Bruce Banks sail with a similarly stickered hull number. Also, now removed, the name 'Fleeced By No Mates' displayed in quality vinyl graphics on either side of the hull! Apparently all the Whitby boys agreed to employ 'No Mates' as part of their Harrier Plus naming system!! In deference to its Whitby origins, I have renamed her 'Scampi'.
I know of no other Harriers up here in Scotland but perhaps, after these postings and pleas, some may come out the woodwork.
Re: Harrier set-up
Hi
I also have one that I am going to take to bough beech tomorrow As to set up,I have found that the rig needs to be raked back a little (5 degrees? ) & then sailed like a phantom,The extra width & having the control lines on the thawth puts you in the right position for the light stuff.
Definatly take a bailer bucket to start the process but the bailer should keep up if sailed flat.
Mainly have fun it`s a lot of boat for little money.
Bert
H+1
Still no mates
I also have one that I am going to take to bough beech tomorrow As to set up,I have found that the rig needs to be raked back a little (5 degrees? ) & then sailed like a phantom,The extra width & having the control lines on the thawth puts you in the right position for the light stuff.
Definatly take a bailer bucket to start the process but the bailer should keep up if sailed flat.
Mainly have fun it`s a lot of boat for little money.
Bert
H+1
Still no mates
Re: Harrier set-up
I got very excited yesterday because I 'found' the sailor of the Harrier I saw out at Hunts earlier in the year! He was one of my students on my Start Racing course. I was plugging the cvrda and our proposed open to the owners of two olde GPs, then described the Lost Class section and he asked if he could bring his Harrier! Result!
The Peril
Agamemnon
Lovely little Cadet
OK 1954
Xena Warrior Princess
Finn 469
Laser 2
Wayfarer World
Agamemnon
Lovely little Cadet
OK 1954
Xena Warrior Princess
Finn 469
Laser 2
Wayfarer World