Wildfire dinghy 133
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Anodepoetry
- Posts: 2
- Joined: Sun Oct 14, 2012 4:57 pm
Wildfire dinghy 133
I've just purchased Wildfire Dinghy 133. She has the appearance of a dinghy that hasn't been used much at all. The sail eyelets are still bright and the sails are very clean. There are the inevitable 'few bits missing'. I need to know how much lead I need to get for the keel. I need to see what it is the mast stands on because mine is missing. I've also got to get/make a tiller (the rudder is fine), the seat on top of the locker, the cover that goes over the top of the keel, and figure out how long the shrouds are as they're missing too. On the positive side what is there has seen very little if any use and is all good quality. Any help or advice any of you can provide would be gratefully received.
Re: Wildfire dinghy 133
Hi,
Good to hear from you and well done for choosing one of the most under-rated boats around. I sail W84 and there is at least one other user of this forum with recent Wildfire experience ..
To answer your questions:
1. Lead: Use shotgun pellets in bags sewn up from old sails. 1 bag should be around 10lb weight and you should have up to 200lbs of lead altogether. Tie the bags together with rope in pairs so that you can put the bags into the keel one on either side of the divider. Be organised about this when you sail then when you come ashore it's easier to locate the topmost bags (you wont manage to lift the bottom bag with ballast on top of it!!) and watch out for the keel popping up and chinning you when it is nearly empty. I regularly sail with 180lbs and you can just about get away with 60lbs as a bare minimum. However - if you don't fill the keel up with lead bags, you really ought to stuff something into the top of the keel otherwise if you do go upside down (very rare but not impossible) the lead can drop to the top of the keel and you lose a lot of righting leverage. I've even heard of them staying upside down in those circumstances. This is for a 4ft keel (the normal one) - there is a 6ft keel out there which, presumably could take more ballast. You'll also find out just how expensive lead shot is!!
2- Mast foot: Any regular 'meccano' style mastfoot will do the job (not the tiddly one as used on the Cadet but anything from a dinghy 14ft upwards should be ok). I assume the original is missing. Before you refit, have a prod and, perhaps do a little test drilling. There is a piece of plywood sandwiched between the crew deck and the fibreglass pedestal inside the bouyancy tank that takes the mast weight. The plywood can/does go rotten with time which would result in your mast settling downwards into the boat and damaging the crew deck. If that doesn't make sense - I'm happy to explain over the phone.
3. Tiller is very low tech. Basically, if it looks right, it will work. Just make sure you have a really snug fit between the tiller and the rudder stock. In big waves the boat can want to take over a little bit and having good, solid contact between your hand and the rudder blade can make it drive less like a Land rover and more like a .... I dunno .. Volvo, perhaps!
4. Shroud length is a little more problematic. I've seen at least two mast types used, both of which have different hounds heights and therefore different shroud lengths. Best I can offer is that the ideal mast rake seems to be with the back edge of the mast roughly in line with the back of the mast gate in the foredeck (without major rig tension or kicker pressure). If you can somehow hold the mast in this position, you might be able to use a bit of string to get the lengths roughly right and use adjuster plates to fine tune it once you've got them made.
5. Locker cover. There are various solutions here. I've seen lids that go all the way across; ours has two 'fixed' parts about 3 - 4" wide at either end and a hinging panel pf plywood for the bulk of the opening (all made from the same plywood piece). I would think 8mm ply would work and, again, personal preference, but we have the hinges at the back at the moment. If you are making one, don't bother trying to make the locker water-tight, although it can be helpful to limit water ingress as best you can, and have a drain plug from the locker. Also - as the lead will likely be the most saleable part of the boat, a good lock (a Mr Bean style padlock and hasp is fine) will give you somewhere secure to store your lead bags.
6. Keel Cover: The original was a 'keel-shaped' fibreglass lid that hooked under a plastic fitting at the back and had a stainless strap over the top secured to the crew deck with pins. We've made our own wooden cap as the original fell apart. The key design consideration is to limit the amount of water that forces up into the cockpit past the keel and, most importantly, to keep the lead inside the keel if you capsize!!
If you like the idea of open water cruising, the Wildfire is very hard to beat. We've camped in ours, had it out in over 30 knots of breeze and covered impressive distances at a fraction of the cost and a multiple of the sailing ability of a 'proper', much bigger yacht. Having the keel is a real reassurance when the wind gets up - but do bear in mind, it makes the boat heavier and therefore a bit harder to stop when coming alongside.
W84 is at Bough Beech SC, near Sevenoaks in Kent. If it's a reasonable proposition for you, you're welcome to come and have a look.
Hope this helps for now - brian at kenttms dot co dot uk if you'd like to chat further.
Brian
Wildfire 84
Contender 2303
Hornet 1964
Good to hear from you and well done for choosing one of the most under-rated boats around. I sail W84 and there is at least one other user of this forum with recent Wildfire experience ..
To answer your questions:
1. Lead: Use shotgun pellets in bags sewn up from old sails. 1 bag should be around 10lb weight and you should have up to 200lbs of lead altogether. Tie the bags together with rope in pairs so that you can put the bags into the keel one on either side of the divider. Be organised about this when you sail then when you come ashore it's easier to locate the topmost bags (you wont manage to lift the bottom bag with ballast on top of it!!) and watch out for the keel popping up and chinning you when it is nearly empty. I regularly sail with 180lbs and you can just about get away with 60lbs as a bare minimum. However - if you don't fill the keel up with lead bags, you really ought to stuff something into the top of the keel otherwise if you do go upside down (very rare but not impossible) the lead can drop to the top of the keel and you lose a lot of righting leverage. I've even heard of them staying upside down in those circumstances. This is for a 4ft keel (the normal one) - there is a 6ft keel out there which, presumably could take more ballast. You'll also find out just how expensive lead shot is!!
2- Mast foot: Any regular 'meccano' style mastfoot will do the job (not the tiddly one as used on the Cadet but anything from a dinghy 14ft upwards should be ok). I assume the original is missing. Before you refit, have a prod and, perhaps do a little test drilling. There is a piece of plywood sandwiched between the crew deck and the fibreglass pedestal inside the bouyancy tank that takes the mast weight. The plywood can/does go rotten with time which would result in your mast settling downwards into the boat and damaging the crew deck. If that doesn't make sense - I'm happy to explain over the phone.
3. Tiller is very low tech. Basically, if it looks right, it will work. Just make sure you have a really snug fit between the tiller and the rudder stock. In big waves the boat can want to take over a little bit and having good, solid contact between your hand and the rudder blade can make it drive less like a Land rover and more like a .... I dunno .. Volvo, perhaps!
4. Shroud length is a little more problematic. I've seen at least two mast types used, both of which have different hounds heights and therefore different shroud lengths. Best I can offer is that the ideal mast rake seems to be with the back edge of the mast roughly in line with the back of the mast gate in the foredeck (without major rig tension or kicker pressure). If you can somehow hold the mast in this position, you might be able to use a bit of string to get the lengths roughly right and use adjuster plates to fine tune it once you've got them made.
5. Locker cover. There are various solutions here. I've seen lids that go all the way across; ours has two 'fixed' parts about 3 - 4" wide at either end and a hinging panel pf plywood for the bulk of the opening (all made from the same plywood piece). I would think 8mm ply would work and, again, personal preference, but we have the hinges at the back at the moment. If you are making one, don't bother trying to make the locker water-tight, although it can be helpful to limit water ingress as best you can, and have a drain plug from the locker. Also - as the lead will likely be the most saleable part of the boat, a good lock (a Mr Bean style padlock and hasp is fine) will give you somewhere secure to store your lead bags.
6. Keel Cover: The original was a 'keel-shaped' fibreglass lid that hooked under a plastic fitting at the back and had a stainless strap over the top secured to the crew deck with pins. We've made our own wooden cap as the original fell apart. The key design consideration is to limit the amount of water that forces up into the cockpit past the keel and, most importantly, to keep the lead inside the keel if you capsize!!
If you like the idea of open water cruising, the Wildfire is very hard to beat. We've camped in ours, had it out in over 30 knots of breeze and covered impressive distances at a fraction of the cost and a multiple of the sailing ability of a 'proper', much bigger yacht. Having the keel is a real reassurance when the wind gets up - but do bear in mind, it makes the boat heavier and therefore a bit harder to stop when coming alongside.
W84 is at Bough Beech SC, near Sevenoaks in Kent. If it's a reasonable proposition for you, you're welcome to come and have a look.
Hope this helps for now - brian at kenttms dot co dot uk if you'd like to chat further.
Brian
Wildfire 84
Contender 2303
Hornet 1964
-
Anodepoetry
- Posts: 2
- Joined: Sun Oct 14, 2012 4:57 pm
Re: Wildfire dinghy 133
Hi Brian and thanks for getting back to me with not only a very comprehensive but also a very informative response. I got a quote for 80Kgs of lead shot that divers use and they want £345! I was wondering about possibly using sand in bags but I discounted that idea as it wouldn't sit as low in the keel and would consequently apply less righting torque to the boat if she were to go over. A friend of mine suggested I go around the tyre bays and ask them to collect all their scrap wheel balancing weights. I was intending to use her for some coastal sailing so I can practice my navigation skills. I will be in touch in the not too distant future when it might be convenient to pop over to see you. Thanks for all your help and perhaps I can supply a jar or two when we meet to show my appreciation? All the best, Andy