Moving class.....to a Cat?

[Ed]

Hi all,

this is one of those 'what boat should I get' posts. Somehow, I never feel like these threads ever really get anywhere, but hopefully it might give me a few interesting bits of info with which to help consider the question.

So the thing is:

I am looking for a new class to sail for a while. A fast singlehander to potentially replace the IC.

This isn't for my classic sailing. I enjoy sailing the Jollyboat and Firefly. One day I will either re-build my MerlinRocket or get another.

So we are not bound by age. I am not bothered whether it is plastic or wood, but would like something which is not too high maintenance. I think by preference plastic.

The problem is: I just love sailing the IC. It is without doubt the best fun boat I have ever sailed, but it demands three things: Time on the water to keep confidence up, Some funding to keep boat on water (need new sails) and time to do the constant fidling and fettling that is half the fun of a dev-class boat.

Without the time and funding to keep on top of the boat, it is becoming a bit of a struggle. If I had the money and time, I would get a new rules boat and go back to attending opens, but this is just not realistic at moment.

So, I have been thinking about what other boats, I could get cheap, to play on and learn some new skills and have a bit of fun.

So I am looking for potential fast'n'fun singlehanders, mainly for low-key racing at Roadford/Plymouth/Saltash

I have thought about monuhulls, especially the Contender and the RS600. I would love to sail both, with a slight preference for the 600. They are both available at cheap prices, but I fear they both would demand quite a bit of 'time on the water' to get over the initial learning curve.

But I am also thinking about Catamarans. Thing is, I know next to nothing about them....and this makes me kind of curious to give them a go, just to try out something different and learn some new skills. I have never helmed a Cat, and only crewed twice, once as a kid on a Unicorn (hanging on for grim death) and once with Alan in his Sheerwater.

So the options I have thought about are:

A-class: Well I can dream can't I? But nothing available cheap, and if I was to spend this amount of money, I would prefer to put it into an IC and stick with that. I would also be too heavy of course.

C-class Not even worth dreaming about really....

Unicorn: I love the Unicorn, it is a dream from my youth....Other than 'A's they are one of the best looking singlehanded cats around. They are a subtle boat, like the IC not a horsepower boat, which I like. Alan has assured me I would be too heavy for one, but looking at the current helms, I would certainly not be the heaviest in the class. I am told they all fall apart, but although this was true of old boats, it doesn't seem true of the new boats, and if anyone can fix it....surely I will be able to. It would provide some class racing if I wanted it. The rig is pretty adjustable. It is a true singlehander. They do come up at reasonable prices occasionally. The unicorn would be my first choice, but what do other cat-sailors think?

NACRA 5.2 The nacra looks like a sensible choice. It can carry tons of weight and can carry crew and/or go singlehanded. But no class racing. The boats are good looking but old and heavy. I have seen reports of a few with catastrophic hull failures. I know Alan loves these......so would this be a better bet. There is (or was) even one for sale at Roadford.....but most proably a bit outside my budget at moment.

Hobie 17 As a rule, I don't like Hobies, they just remind me of beach boats being rented off a club-med resort.....but the Hobie 17 is a bit different and I quite like the look of these, but don't have much idea about them....Anybody fill me in?

Dart No, just don't like em, think it is the lack of daggers that does it for me

Catapult To be honest, I would more rather give up sailing...

What are the classic options?

What other modern options are there?

Any other advice on the whole concept of giving cats a go?

@PeteV @AlanW: especially interested in your thoughts and experiences.

cheers

eib

[roger]

Ed, I know nothing about cats either but what about the Spitfire?

[Ed]

Classic boats are expensive enough, but I really don't want to get into classic aircraft!

eib

[roger]

Ha yes that would set you back a little.

No just realised the Spitfire is two handed I meant the Shadow.

But I cant find a class association but they do have a Nationals.


http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/news/1 ... at-Gurnard

[davidh]

Ed,

The suggestion on the Shadow is a damn good idea! I was PRO for their Nationals a few years back and was impressed with their quality and the sailing 'experience' that they offered.Personally though, I'd not get too hung up about the whole weight thing unless you have serious aspirations to race the thing hard and then yes, that is tipping you more towards an 'A' Class cat (we've a number of them at Netley now and they are awesome beasts).

BUT....beasts they remain! No other way of saying it. We've got a quite good Finn sailor here who was 'thinking' a bit like yourself, so he sold his boat and bought an A Class - only to find that the learning curve was even steeper than on a comparable dinghy. With that wing sectioned mast, even when you release the mainsheet you still have power on. Sheet in and things start to happen very quickly indeed! In the end out ex-Finn sailor sold the boat on again after a season as it was just too much for him as a one day a weekend club sailor.

In theory, a Unicorn IS an A Class and like you, these boats are almost a part of my sailing 'childhood'. I sailed them a bit up at Weston and loved it - classic with capital C! It is such a shame that I don't think that there are any of the Australis A Class boats left in the UK, this was the boat that benefited from the political 'wheeler dealings' that went on after the Cat Trials back in the 60s - the UK got the B class with the Tornado, Australia got the A Class with Australis - such a pretty boat with curved beams and an amazing hull form that had all the buoyancy under the trampoline, aft of that the hulls tapered back to a point! Personally, given the effects of being like the Census statistics (broken down by Age and Sex) I'd go for the Unicorn, not worry too much about the racing and really enjoy the sensation of sailing what is, to me, one of the 'pretty' cats!

Good luck Ed, make sure you keep us all informed of progress!

[Rupert]

I grew up dreaming of Unicorns (as did Pip when younger, but her's were horse based), but as I sailed on a river, I never got near to one.

I have sailed some big French cats, which all seemed the same, really, and the Hobie 14, which was great fun till it pitchpoled and broke... Took an age to get upright and back into Aberystwyth harbour. Crewed a Dart 18 down in Falmouth a couple of times - looking back at an Int 14 planing its bollocks off while we were simply scooting along going faster was fun.

Looking at the recent cat designs down in Weymouth, the hull volumes appear to have shrunk dramatically. I'm guessing the curved foils on the new Olympic cat give the lift, so you don't need the volume. Probably not very beginner friendly.

I hate to say this, but maybe some lessons in a Dart16 or similar might be a good plan before jumping in something that might bite you in an expensive way?

[Obscured by clouds]

I loved my Unicorn, until it came apart off Abersoch one windy day. Never really repaired it well enough to instil confidence on the sea. It was finally written off when a Tornado flipped onto it during a vicious squall on the beach. the mast was one of those bendy things that would do all sorts of contortions if you got the tension wrong.

I then salvaged a 17' Mystere which I sailed all over the bay and once overnighted on when the wind disappeared on one of my long trips. Not particularly fast by modern standards it was great for s/handing and cruising. I gave to to a local who has since done nothing with it so I may end up taking it back in hand.

If you want to race on a resevoir or Bala I'd certainly consider the Unicorn. If you want to generally tool around at speed then I reckon the Hobie 17 would be my choice, plus it's a comfy ride with the added wings/seats.

[PeterV]

I have sailed both unicorns and other A classes (anyone remember the Australis?). The unicorn has always been stronger and better built than its competitors so I wouldn't worry about it falling apart. I never really liked the extremely bendy mast but it does give some adjustment in the rig. The best unicorn sailer at my club was a Jack Russell who ran up and down the hulls forward of the main beam barking at other boats!

I sailed a Contender for a year in Bristol docks, it really wasn't any more difficult than a Laser so I wouldn't discount it. The view from the trapeze is great and I would have kept if a certain Finn hadnt turned up!

I very nearly bid on a Condor on eBay last week. They were great cats but ruined as a class by a new builder changing the rig and killing the class overnight. Not quite classic but truly a lost class and really nice to sail. I clearly should have done then we could start a CVRDA cat class!

[Nessa]

yes, if you can sail an IC you can sail a contender, but there would still be enough of a challenge to make it interesting. An amazing boat.

All I know about cats is they are demanding, make a lot of noise and are bad for birds. Good to cuddle though.

[JimC]

Thing is Ed, why do you think a development boat needs significantly more maintenance than a one design? You know all the regular stuff, sails, gear, foils and so on is just the same. Reckon the only difference is that you can't buy all the bits off the shelf...

[davidh]

Peter (V).......

if you jump back to my post you'll see that I do indeed remember the Australis - very well in fact. We had one sailing locally for a while but with Mazzoti boats pretty much on our doorstep, Weston became the hot bed of Unicorn action - one year iirc they filled the top spot at the nationals and 4 out of the top 5. As I was Contendering and 505 crewing up there (not to mention sailing Hornets but sadly that remains a bit of an alcoholic haze) I had plenty of opportunity to get some Unicorn sailing in - loose rigging, bendy Needlespar (again local) masts but just so so quick and a joy to sail.

A later Unicorn, once subject to the usual checks, should be a great boat and whilst scarily fast, is nowhere near the total shock to the system that a modern A Class would be. As a long term Contender sailor, when the wind is up and there is a bit of 'popple' on the water - say wind over tide, you race upwind with one thought in your mind.... the bear away at the top mark (Nessa knows this bit well) - it is at this point you're happy to be in a Contender and NOT in an RS 600!! The Contender is actually very well behaved and as long as you crack a bit of kicker first, with practice the boat turns and just 'picks up' whilst you move aft on the trapeze pretty much to the stern deck. I was doing this earlier this season when the A Class came around, as he tried to bear away the boat simply took off, went 100 m at warp speed then went over. I think you'd have gotten a Unicorn around okay - and made it down the reach too!

I have a feeling that the Australis suffered from just one too many 'design shortcomings' but oh my, it was a pretty boat - as far as I know, there are none left here in the UK (well, I tried to hunt one down for a Dinghy Mag article a couple of years back and drew a blank!)

D

[PeterV]

David,
I wonder if I remember a different Australis or it was just wrongly named. It was a boat with flimsy flexible hulls and wooden decks that hardly ever stayed joined to the hulls. The hull shape was fairly similar to a unicorn.

[neil]

Where are you planning to sail your new craft? Will you be joining the elderly Dart fleet at RoystonVaseyford Lake Sailing Club?

[Rupert]

The Australis I know of is the trials winner with the canoe sterns. Sadly, by the time I was old enough, the only ones I could see were in pictures in Catamaran Racing.

It is probably just as well that no one boat domiated the A Class trials, or we might have lost them, as we did the B class because of the Tornado. The F18 is a poor subsitute.

[davidh]

Peter,

as Rupert said, one 'feature' of the Australis was the way that the aft section of the hulls narrowed down to almost canoe style section. The thinking behind this was that the lack of hull volume aft would counteract any potential nose diving. The other big feature was the main beams, which were arc'ed upwards. The result was a very 'pretty' boat that was also very quick.

sorry Rupert, I'm unsure of your comment re the B Class......... the Tornado was - and is, a wonderful boat that you have to experience. BUT, talk of the class shooting itself in the foot, the 'arms race' in the Tornados was getting scary and there were measurement 'tweaks' creeping in that risked creating even more of what has been described on this forum as 'chequebook' sailing. The F18, with carbon banned and a far more sensible approach to development, is a far easier concept to adopt!

Sadly the A Class is now following suit with boats getting ever more expensive......the latest arrival at Netley has the curved foils and is a work of art weighing in 'complete' at about 70 kilos - but I'd not want to be footing the bills!

D