weighted dagger board.

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ent228
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Re: weighted dagger board.

Post by ent228 » Sun Jan 11, 2015 7:16 pm

Just for fun then...........

I like the previous idea of putting on a lightweight rig and also reefing it as above.

So....

I like reefing but don't like having all that mast up there swinging around. Early 14s had sliding gunter rigs so the top mast came down as well.

How about updating it? Use carbon fibre and have the top mast telescoping into the lower just above the hounds. I don't know how it could be done, nesting sailtracks as well? Have the whole lot on a single string sytem.

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jpa_wfsc
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Re: weighted dagger board.

Post by jpa_wfsc » Sun Jan 11, 2015 7:59 pm

ent228 wrote:Just for fun then...........

I like the previous idea of putting on a lightweight rig and also reefing it as above.

So....

I like reefing but don't like having all that mast up there swinging around. Early 14s had sliding gunter rigs so the top mast came down as well.

How about updating it? Use carbon fibre and have the top mast telescoping into the lower just above the hounds. I don't know how it could be done, nesting sailtracks as well? Have the whole lot on a single string sytem.
The telescoping mast has been done - I saw at some boat show somewhere -but the sliding gunter (like Mirror, Herron, Gull) makes for a very practical boat and in modern light but durable materials e.g. carbon fibre, even more desirable... However - having re-read why this paper exercise started at all, I realise that I missed the point - we should be discussing able, but older sailor's needs. For them, the Skua, Swordfish, etc would be very suitable, and with a proper reefing system always manageable. Other alternatives exist many based on local fishing types like the salcombe yawl, yachting world dayboat - all designed from the outset with a weighted centreboard.

I'm still convinced that adding weight to a light planing focused racing dinghy is inherently a bad idea.
j./

National 12 "Spider" 2523
Finn K468 'Captain Scarlet'

British Moth, 630, early 60's 'Pisces'

!!!! Not CVRDA !!!!
Comet Trio - something always ready to sail.

JimC
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Re: weighted dagger board.

Post by JimC » Sun Jan 11, 2015 8:33 pm

I think you need the top mast to stay a constant length.

Its more 'conventional' to stump the mast down at the bottom. This is how I did it on my one off singlehander. There's a separate tube to gooseneck height that the mast telescopes down into. The tube is located in place my the lowers and the prod on the front. The prod is on a track so that the rake can be adjusted.

Image

In the lower picture you can just see a loose loop of string. This is attached to a big pin (actually a dethreaded 100mm bolt) which goes right through the mast. Pull the pin out and the mast drops down to the lower position. The shrouds have extra eyes swaged on for the lower positions and just use fast pins. Same on the forestay, with a big highfield lever for rig tension.

To put the reef in take the rig tension off, pull out the pin, let the mast drop, connect up the lower shroud positions and put the tension on again and retension main halyward. Then roll up the bottom of the sail - there are extra tack and clew points and the excess just zips up. It was quite possible to do this at a jetty without even dropping the mainsail.


Image

Rupert
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Re: weighted dagger board.

Post by Rupert » Mon Jan 12, 2015 2:50 pm

On a more stable boat I'm sure you could do that on the water, too. Not sure how easy it would be to unreef afloat, though?
Rupert

JimC
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Re: weighted dagger board.

Post by JimC » Mon Jan 12, 2015 3:06 pm

Rupert wrote:On a more stable boat I'm sure you could do that on the water, too. Not sure how easy it would be to unreef afloat, though?
The challenge with doing it on the water is that for the duration of the exercise the mast is unstayed, so if the sail fills or you manage to capsize... I suppose an unstayed rig like the Laser EPS could work. "Shaking the reef out" on the jetty wasn't much harder than putting it in.

ent228
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Location: Stoke Gabriel, On the Dart, South Devon

Re: weighted dagger board.

Post by ent228 » Mon Jan 12, 2015 3:43 pm

Just for accuracy, the Mirror, Gull and Heron don't have sliding gunter rigs.
The Sliding gunter has a throat halyard as well and the peak halyard terminates on a track or wire on the front of the gaff to allow the sliding when throat halyard is eased.

I used a sliding gunter when sailing those big heavy grp sailing boats (17ft?)called I think "ASCs" that the sea cadets and the Navy had back in the 70's. Anyone else had experience of them?

Michael Brigg
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Re: weighted dagger board.

Post by Michael Brigg » Tue Jan 13, 2015 4:19 pm

Just for fun then,..

I would want an extending mast and spring loaded sail hoist, with a central integrated Coffee grinder winch/tiller extention.

A multihull would lend stability...and with no need for weighted daggerboards, speed. + for mobility , a trimaran

It has been done... (one of my favourite films...) :D

https://?v=VKFsmZhQWtg[/youtube]


On the subject of boards...
I have an F2 lightening race, I bought it in 1983. It is definately not an old mans board. It is complete (+ full size 7.5m sail with camber inducers) other than the hard plastic slot covers (they split and had to be replaced by the standard rubber ones.) and my "extra height" tapered aluminium mast finally gave up the fight againt corrosion and developed a vertical split about 6 feet long from base upwards. :oops: :cry: Anyone know of any replacement?
Michael Brigg

ent228
Posts: 226
Joined: Thu Nov 27, 2008 11:32 pm
Location: Stoke Gabriel, On the Dart, South Devon

Re: weighted dagger board.

Post by ent228 » Tue Jan 13, 2015 6:18 pm

Yes the sequences of getting the trimaran underway or wonderful.

Probably the only way forward for the F2 mast will be a newer plastic one. Are the mast extensions for alloy masts the same diameter as for plastic ones? This is all well before my time, I've never even seen an alloy sailboard mast!

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jpa_wfsc
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Re: weighted dagger board.

Post by jpa_wfsc » Wed Jan 14, 2015 12:53 pm

ent228 wrote:Just for accuracy, the Mirror, Gull and Heron don't have sliding gunter rigs.
true - but to make it happen I added a second halyard loop on the gunter, so I could reef without the gunter being all the way up whcih kept the sail setting nicely. I got the idea from a Heron that was equiped like that.
j./

National 12 "Spider" 2523
Finn K468 'Captain Scarlet'

British Moth, 630, early 60's 'Pisces'

!!!! Not CVRDA !!!!
Comet Trio - something always ready to sail.

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