Does the FB Group support the CVRDA Mission?

and what is happening with the CVRDA today?
User avatar
Ed
Site Admin
Posts: 3486
Joined: Wed Sep 01, 2004 10:11 pm
Location: Plymouth
Contact:

Does the FB Group support the CVRDA Mission?

Post by Ed » Sat Oct 31, 2020 12:23 pm

The Facebook group has continued to grow and now has around 1850 members, with a very wide geographical readership. There are regular new posts and lots of comments, from core association members, the regular 'classic sailing' pundits and from less familiar names from around the world. Again and again, I have seen a well known sailor or designer's 'name' and thought. 'Gosh, is that....? can't be....' only to find it indeed was. Fantastic!

And yet..... There are some of us who feel that as addictive and exciting as Facebook certainly is, we are unsure that the FB group really supports the CVRDA mission.

I would really like to open up some discussion on this topic, here on the forum and would value your thoughts.

My thoughts:

When Neil and I set up the CVRDA FB group (By Neil: Sep 7 2007) we used the CVRDA Mission as a group description, with the main intentions to:

  • get classic and vintage racing dinghies racing together as often as possible
  • share and disseminate information about classic and vintage dinghies.
  • get classic and vintage dinghies on the water for people to use, see and appreciate.
  • to keep all these boats sailing and in good condition and viewed by as large an audience as possible and to raise the public awareness of these boats and the nautical heritage they represent.
  • to help and support classic class associations finding it hard to compete in the modern sailing scene and help them find hosts for their nats.

However, our main intention was for the FB group to be used for ephemeral 'chat' mainly around the organisation and marketing of CVRDA events. We set the FBgroup up to encourage and support owners of classic boats to attend CVRDA events. That was it. That was the purpose of the FB group.

Our presumption was that the normal discussion, that intended to: 'share and disseminate information' would remain on the forum, where it is searchable and we can make some effort to try and keep it for a few years at least. I just want to cry when I see interesting material is posted on the FB Group, knowing that it will be impossible to find in a few days time. The bottom line is that the traffic on FB has totally sucked the forum dry......so is this a problem?

The flipside to this is the incredible ease of using FaceBook and the wide range of content from very knowledgeable sources that the FB group now enjoys.....but does this support the mission? and does it support the association? I am not sure.

I have some potential ideas for how we might go forward, but first, I would really appreciate any thoughts from the CVRDA Members and Forum Members.

I look forward to hearing what you think, here, on FB or if you wish by private message.

Best wishes

eib
Ed Bremner
CVRDA


Jollyboat J3
Firefly F2942
IC GBR314 ex S51 - 1970 Slurp
MR 638 - Please come and take it away
Phelps Scull
Bathurst Whiff - looking for someone to love it

User avatar
PeterV
Posts: 1219
Joined: Thu Sep 16, 2004 8:47 pm
Location: Locks Heath, Hampshire

Re: Does the FB Group support the CVRDA Mission?

Post by PeterV » Sat Oct 31, 2020 5:23 pm

I have no answers, but I agree that the FB page has sucked the forum dry. Just looking at the sparceness of the forum posts shows that, and this means there's no search option for interesting topics. I also note the fb pages get lots of irrelevant content on from around the world.
Fb seems to be taking over everywhere, but it seems a juggernaut without brakes.
PeterV
Finn K197 & GBR564
Warsash

Pat
Posts: 2503
Joined: Mon Sep 27, 2004 1:42 pm
Location: West Wiltshire (Wessex)

Re: Does the FB Group support the CVRDA Mission?

Post by Pat » Sat Oct 31, 2020 7:25 pm

The trouble with FaceBook (from our point of view) is the ease of use. Posting and loading decent quality images is just so simple and the News Feed and Notifications ensures that new content is brought to your attention even before you open FaceBook. It makes the forum look somewhat clunky and old fashioned.

I'm guilty too of frequently getting contacts through the website from people who have a boat to sell that fits our criteria and saying to them "Best to post it on our FaceBook page with pictures". It saves me being involved and lets them make contact with potential takers. Though I've also recommended the Dinghies and Dinghy Bits for more modern and old wing boats.

I don't know what the solution is here. Less people use the forum so less people post. Because less people post, less people use the forum. I can only suggest a posting blitz of interesting stuff so there is something good to come here for. With another lockdown looming there is going to be demand for advice on varnishing and renovation again - our biggest hit page last lockdown was the varnishing advice!
(Half Cut and What a Lark Removals Ltd)

User avatar
PeterV
Posts: 1219
Joined: Thu Sep 16, 2004 8:47 pm
Location: Locks Heath, Hampshire

Re: Does the FB Group support the CVRDA Mission?

Post by PeterV » Sat Oct 31, 2020 8:49 pm

How practical would it be to post just links on fb to content on the website?
PeterV
Finn K197 & GBR564
Warsash

User avatar
azimuth
Posts: 152
Joined: Thu Sep 11, 2008 10:13 pm

Re: Does the FB Group support the CVRDA Mission?

Post by azimuth » Sat Oct 31, 2020 9:46 pm

I completely get the issue re fb drawing traffic away from the forum but can’t help thinking losing fb would do more harm than good... fb being so much easier to access and getting so much more traffic from a wider range of people (I imagine)....
Keith.

Finn K60 'Sfinnx' Fairey
Zenith 74 'Azimuth' (rescued from the undergrowth 20yrs ago)
Zenith 61 'Bali Hai'... A family heirloom...

Pat
Posts: 2503
Joined: Mon Sep 27, 2004 1:42 pm
Location: West Wiltshire (Wessex)

Re: Does the FB Group support the CVRDA Mission?

Post by Pat » Sun Nov 01, 2020 8:54 am

PeterV wrote:
Sat Oct 31, 2020 8:49 pm
How practical would it be to post just links on fb to content on the website?
Very easy to do. And an admin can turn off discussion on FB to keep it all on the forum.
(Half Cut and What a Lark Removals Ltd)

Michael4
Posts: 502
Joined: Fri Jan 03, 2014 5:25 pm
Location: West Sussex

Re: Does the FB Group support the CVRDA Mission?

Post by Michael4 » Sun Nov 01, 2020 11:59 am

..of course most will never know of this debate because they will only be on FB...

For what it is worth I think FB is good but it is much like a stream of consciousness emanating from a group of somewhat forgetful people.

Any threads on the forum seem to have much less 'thread drift' and are easy to refer back to (which isn't so easy on FB). Threads on the forum become individual lumps of information. In other words the meat of other's knowledge is best held on the forum, accessible and reasonably easy to find.

I am involved in other pursuits that have the same problem. I must say the most valuable (ie those that have the most contributors who know roughly what they are talking about) have held off starting a Facebook group but that does sound somewhat luddite (which I suppose I am).

Having said all that I suppose that if you live by your phone (we have no signal!) then FB is just part of your everyday world and anything therein becomes part of the daily routine.

Yes, I suppose promoting what is going on on the forum on the FB group is a good idea but there is precious little happening there at the moment...
Tideway 206
11+
Sold the 'Something bigger and plastic', it never got used.

Rupert
Posts: 6254
Joined: Thu Sep 16, 2004 8:40 pm
Location: Cotswold Water Park

Re: Does the FB Group support the CVRDA Mission?

Post by Rupert » Sun Nov 01, 2020 10:24 pm

Many websites have simply given up having a forum and use Facebook. From that point of view, the cvrda forum is doing better than most.

Agree entirely on the seachability thing, on the off topic stuff, on all the other issues that have popped up over the last few years. But in the end it is where people will go to post a picture of an old Mirror dinghy in order to get validation for spending time and money on something they could simply buy a better example of, for less.
Rupert

davidh
Posts: 3166
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2005 10:43 am
Location: Ventor Isle of Wight

Re: Does the FB Group support the CVRDA Mission?

Post by davidh » Sat Nov 28, 2020 11:52 am

Hi all - picking up on the point that Rupert has just made, many of the 'established' classes that I work with are seeing this shift taking place, with more and more of their connection with the members - and their promotion to the outside world taking place via social media platforms. Those that are looking to be successful at managing this change are those that are not just accepting the new ways of working but are pro-active in the way that they are driving things - and shaping them as they do so.

It would be a stretch that I'm not happy to make to blame the covid lockdown for all this, as in many ways these changes were happening already, but there is now doubt in my mind (and from the work I'm doing both with classes and media outlets) that the protracted lockdown has turbo-charged the rate of change.

One of the trends we have noted is the rapid shift in the media used. In the past, a b&w picture would help tell the story, then full HD colour...podcasts....but now if you want to get your message across then you have to be capable of using (and supporting easily) the full suite of multi-media...and the on line social media platforms - like Facebook - are superb for this.

This though could be good for the classic scene and therefore, by association, the CVRDA. Many people will have read about boats ranging from the Alpha to the Zenith - but their knowledge is often limited to that aforementioned b&w picture or what is in the Boat-World Guide to dinghies. Using video gives an opportunity to not just record but promote. There is also the added plus point that many of the classic boats are so pretty and or interesting, idea subjects for the full multi-media exposure.

Along with the rest of the sport, the classics scene is already well into a period of transition, ca plus ca change as they used to say pre-Brexit which suggests that for now, there should be room for both Forum and FB, though the expectation is that one will possibly/probably grow at the expense of the other. This is though an opportunity to be taken and bent to our particular use and if I can help in any way with that, then please take it that the offer has been made.
I've some interesting classic work, mainstream classic (ie, not 14 or Merlin related) that I'm working on now and that will take the form of full multi-media - text, photos and video - this will go up on the Y&Y.com site but the promotion of this will be via social media because, in the end, that is where people, followers if you want to use the term, potential future followers, plus anyone who may be interested, is to be found.

Regards and an early season's greetings to you all,

Dougal
David H

chris
Posts: 2455
Joined: Sat Sep 18, 2004 7:43 pm
Location: somerset

Re: Does the FB Group support the CVRDA Mission?

Post by chris » Wed Dec 02, 2020 1:34 pm

Yes the pros and cons mentioned above I agree with. Certainly the forum is not what it used to be but FB does support the CVRDA mission but in a different way now. I, personally, don’t ‘get’ Facebook and don’t sign up to friends and other pages, I dislike so much of it that I sign out of it for weeks or months every so often when I get put off. It was months before I got a note saying my wife wanted to be a friend and I’m not sure I said yes even!

So what to do about it? A suggestion:

Perhaps the forum and other aspects of the website, such as the dinghy database, should become more of the reference library accessible perhaps to paid up members only ( though it is good to see how so many FB users have paid). The reference side of things is the bit that FB lacks whereas the forum no longer needs the Banter or perhaps the Boat Chat sections. My suggestion would be to rethink the categories so that headings might be As helpful as possible for searching subjects such as
‘Boat finishes’ subheadings ‘epoxy/varnish/g4’ etc
‘Hull Repairs’ subheadings clinker/glued ply/laminated etc
‘History’. Subheadings class research/lost lasses/designers/eminent sailors etc.
Etc.
Etc.

I think it should remain as some people can add information to, as long as it is pertinent if it is easy to search then if someone asks on Facebook about a topic for the umpteenth time how to do something then rather than having a long and repetitive fab thread that disappears a link to the forum can give them the information or ideas they need. The dinghy database is a very good resource and I think the old forum could be reworked to be one as well.
Chris

SoggyBadger
Posts: 276
Joined: Mon Jan 31, 2011 8:39 pm
Location: Staffordshire

Re: Does the FB Group support the CVRDA Mission?

Post by SoggyBadger » Thu Dec 03, 2020 11:54 am

It would be a shame to see the forum go but I flatly refuse to use Facebook. I will not surrender my private life to enrich an evil Yankee billionaire regardless of the consequences.
Best wishes


SB

User avatar
JB9
Posts: 416
Joined: Wed Apr 09, 2008 8:52 am
Location: BBSC, Kent, UK

Re: Does the FB Group support the CVRDA Mission?

Post by JB9 » Wed Jan 06, 2021 12:37 pm

I have noted the significant reduction in use of the forum and the rise of posts on the fb group. I think that for now this is the way of things if the CVRDA wants to reach a much bigger audience. A few thoughts on making the situation better for the forum:-
    • As Chris suggested a rethink of the categories on the forum.
        More links from the fb group to the relevant forum category
          A moderator on fb could more closely check the relevance of the posts and copy relevant posts to the forum. I suspect that would be a difficult task.
            I think the forum should be retained and its use encouraged on fb.

            I hope that helps.
        Pegasus - 198

        User avatar
        neil
        Site Admin
        Posts: 1637
        Joined: Tue Aug 31, 2004 10:33 pm
        Location: Plymouth

        Re: Does the FB Group support the CVRDA Mission?

        Post by neil » Mon Jan 11, 2021 1:30 pm

        OK, I'm having to spent a fair bit of time managing the FB group. There's been a crop of spammers trying to join, I can spot most of them but the odd one does get through. Doe mean I have to check the profile of everyone joining and make a judgment call.

        When we set up the FB groups we had it as public so anyone could see all the posts. One way of stopping the spammers is to make the group private (as many groups are).

        Thoughts please.
        IC: K26
        Harrier +: 2

        Zenith's rebuild - www.pegasus18.com/zenith

        Michael4
        Posts: 502
        Joined: Fri Jan 03, 2014 5:25 pm
        Location: West Sussex

        Re: Does the FB Group support the CVRDA Mission?

        Post by Michael4 » Mon Jan 11, 2021 2:27 pm

        I wouldn't hesitate to take the FB group private, doesn't solve everything but certainly makes moderation easier.

        If they are really interested in the subject they'll apply to join anyway.

        I am a 'mod' on some groups for my other interests. Most have now gone private.
        Tideway 206
        11+
        Sold the 'Something bigger and plastic', it never got used.

        davidh
        Posts: 3166
        Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2005 10:43 am
        Location: Ventor Isle of Wight

        Re: Does the FB Group support the CVRDA Mission?

        Post by davidh » Sat Jan 16, 2021 2:41 pm

        Neil.....it is a tough one but rather than have to make a choice between one and the other, the 'going private' route may well be the lesser of two evils. If you are interested enough in the classics scene, then you will be a part of the main thing, if you are not....case rests.

        In the end, it is the likes of you and Ed who keep this going, so it has to be what works for you.

        D
        David H

        Post Reply