Harrier No. 10 FOR SALE

Post your items here & they may be copied over to the for sale section of the CVRDA site
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Re: Harrier No. 10 FOR SALE

Post by Silverwood » Sat Jul 03, 2010 10:42 am

No viking funeral required - boat was sailing last weekend! Responsive, neutaral helm, comfy and plenty of room. If keeping it I would upgrade to modern cleats and low friction blocks but keep to the ethos of the rules by keeping the sidedecks clear and utilising the "twin towers". Transom seems sound and transom flaps only need sorting for cosmetic reasons.

Low definition photos available - awaiting high def ones - will try and post a link!

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Re: Harrier No. 10 FOR SALE

Post by Ancient Geek » Sat Jul 03, 2010 11:01 am

The nautical name for the "Twin Towers" (With its unfortunate connotations.) is "Barney Post" BTW.

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Re: Harrier No. 10 FOR SALE

Post by KeithCallaghan » Sat Jul 03, 2010 11:04 am

Hello all. Thanks to Silverwood for directing me to this thread.
The Harrier's big weakness was its original rig - the sail area was insufficient for light airs and the rig was uncontrollable in a blow. So I agree with David that some cheap and simple mods are in order (fit lowers and add spreaders. The Harrier's potential is realised more fully when a Phantom rig is added.
The Harrier was built in solid GRP, so the hulls have lasted well, but nowadays thay could be built at least 25kg lighter. With a light hull, modern foils and a Phantom rig, that boat would fly!
PS. If you want an endorsement of the Harrier, contact Michael McNamara, who now has a Harrier+.

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Re: Harrier No. 10 FOR SALE

Post by jon711 » Sat Jul 03, 2010 11:10 am

Is the Harrier + CVRDA eligible??

If so, may we see Mike Mac sailing in the CVRDA fleet at Oulton Week??? Let's wait and see..


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Re: Harrier No. 10 FOR SALE

Post by Silverwood » Sat Jul 03, 2010 11:11 am

Thanks Ancient! Barney post it is.... although the contemporary Y&Y report calls them twin pillars ... link to photos is:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/grahamrbir ... 411401230/
Last edited by Silverwood on Sat Jul 03, 2010 11:33 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Harrier No. 10 FOR SALE

Post by Silverwood » Sat Jul 03, 2010 11:26 am

My understanding is that the original Harrier is CVRDA eligible as a lost class designed in 1972. However, the Harrier + (with Phantom rig) has never to my knowledge been designated as a class so cannot be lost! Hence my wish to keep the Harrier in a near original state, which with Keiths comments above (thanks Keith) indicate a light helmsperson is what is required to optimise performance. If Keith thinks lowers are a good idea, and the CVRDA measurer (or commitee?) wish to allow them, then great! If not then existing mast with spreaders is the way to go retaining the ethos of the original.
I see no reason why the boat cannot be sailed as a Harrier + for club events with the original rig being used for CVRDA events!

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Re: Harrier No. 10 FOR SALE

Post by Silverwood » Sat Jul 03, 2010 11:29 am

By the way, with saggy sail and no spreaders I was keeping pace with a similar age OK with a similar size helm..... I think I had a more comfortable sail though, with tacking and gybing a doddle due to the deep wide cockpit and good boom height.

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Re: Harrier No. 10 FOR SALE

Post by DavidC » Sat Jul 03, 2010 11:32 am

Class rules of this age always tend to leave more holes than intended. As a "One Design" then the intention was no doubt to have limited changes or development. However, there was obviously some latitude as there seems to be a 100mm tolerance on the front face of the mast which is large to say the least!

The centreboard must be of wood and yet there is no restriction on the materials for the rudder so any material is available, then and now. I can hear the cry, "not carbon" but carbon was available as a product by the time the Harrier was designed even if it had not found it's way into boats. Certainly glass was being used for moulded foils in the 50's and don't forget that I can use boring old glass fibre with properties that outstrip carbon.

From this I would say that one has to be very careful when assessing the "ethos" or "Spirit" of the rules. It is unfortunately subjective and even in a class when active would have changed with regularity. Generally the "spirit of the rule" argument always caused more problems than it solved. Today, rules are written as fact not ethos because you can't measure ethos or spirit.

Some rules will be obvious but there are many holes here. I doubt the mast section is still available so if a new mast was needed then you immediately have a problem.

With regard to the rig, as you say, you must have a forestay and two shrouds. by implication - although not statement - you cannot have more than two so lowers are out. As are rams etc because of the prohibition.

The spreaders are even more of a problem. The rules do not mention them so again by implication they are not allowed, but there are photos with them so you can then argue that they should be allowed.

This is why class rules should be treated with care and ethos and spirit more so.

As Keith says, the boats weakness was its rig and so some small improvements in that area would seem advisable and no doubt would have become the norm in the class. The overall looks of the boat will be the same so the " spirit" will be the same!

D :)

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Re: Harrier No. 10 FOR SALE

Post by davidh » Sat Jul 03, 2010 11:36 am


I think you've just about hit the 'nail on the head' - a very good compromise between preservation and modernisation. I cannot see the harrier+ being cvrda legit, in that I'm with you 100%.

But with the original rig, albeit with some modernisation, I can see the Harrier being a very nice cvrda boat with the added bonus that like Keith's Merlins (from where the design came in the first place) the helm gets a good sailing experience. I sailed one back in their early days and the rig issues aside, the boat felt 'good' - always a positive indicator of a good design! I'll try to dig out the lost classes article but I seem to recall that this was the conclusion I reached back when writing up about the boat!

Looking forward to seeing it at a cvrda event sometime soon


Keith: If you read this - will be be around Oulton Broad at all during the regatta week?

David H